Hello i am wondering if any 3d party plugin developer is gonna support the next coming v8 of ElectricImage in case there is any.People like Northern Lights or TripleDTools have not yet said something about updates on their plug ins. I guess everyone is waiting for Tesla to kick in with new revenues for EITG.
Is there anybody besides RAMJAC or Paralumino( as we all know ) developing anything for EIAS or is everybody waiting for TESLA and the future of ANIMATOR?
Or is just me freaking out.
Does anybody has got some news in when is TESLA coming out(anything),the 3rd party plug-ins are waiting for Tesla so am I.
Have you guys at EITG thought about EIASv8 new technologies or your main focus will be on Camera only and leave Animator as it is?
Paralumino’s plugin lineup will continue to be updated for v8. No worries there. Northernlights has already converted all their plugs to Universal Binary, so they should work with v8 as well… provided nothing drastic changes. As for TripleD.. well.. they’re still sitting on the fence. They said they would port to UB.. but not sure.
Tesla will mean a shift in the EI universe...but one shouldn’t think it will be in a negative way. A lot of people are looking to see what Tesla does before “jumping”. The state of the 3rd party developers remains unknown as far as Tesla is concerned. I’m not even aware if a Plugin infrastructure is even supported in that application yet.
There has been an initial list of features developed for v8 some on Camera, some on Animator.
So a number of things are in transition. We just need to see all the pieces fall into place.. whatever they may be.
I obviously cant speak for EI, or the other plug in vendors, but I am pretty happy all things considered
with what we have in terms of plug ins. The ‘best’ in my opinion was konkeptoine, and those are almost all
available now. Paralumino has some great tools as well. I would rather have fewer but better plugins,
than a mix of junk and quality. (I miss Onyx tree storm, Eps Invigerator the most) and I would like a good
particle effects tool. (but I get away with my existing particle tools pretty well now)
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My feeling is a bit obvious to most of us. EIAS is coming out with v8. Without good advertising its not going to
do a whole lot in new sales. Upgrades, yes. Camera, realistically is Brads big investment and jewel of EIAS. (Tesla Will be his second jewel, if done well) He will polish that jewel to keep its value up. Good business decision. So, my guess is v8 with 85% camera improvements 15% ‘other’.
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Will any NEW developers jump on board for v8. Why, with no resources for marketing its gonna have a hard time shaking its ‘mostly’ unfair past image. Everyone here knows that (AT THIS TIME) for me, pro modeler + Paralumino + EI = THE BEST 3D Broadcast Design and motion graphics tool available. In my STRONG opinion, EI needs to tweak animator ‘just a little’ and TARGET entry level 3d designers. Easy to learn and use INTERNAL, non Tesla modeling tools are agonizingly close to being a reality. EI and those tools at an aggressive price has the BEST chance of moving a lot more seats of animator. EIAS is on its way to becoming the “2nd Tier” application ANYWAY, next to Tesla. So why not focus it more. It makes a lot of sense, and the beauty of it is their is no real competition in this market anywhere near EI’s pricepoint and EASE OF USE, all things new to 3d users love to hear. Throw in Cameras quality, well, im rambling here.... These users are NOT users who envision themselves making a career in 3d. Maya and Cinema are good starting points for that. And soon TESLA! eventually. EIAS should sell a few more seats
bundled with Tesla as well. (no marketing however = :( )
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my point related to your question was long but can be explained simply here. Better more focused (mograph) EI, sells more copies of EI. More copies of EI = larger pool of potential plug in BUYERS. Which = more people willing to invest their time CREATING or Reviving old and new Plug ins!
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This can happen pretty quickly if EITG wants it to. Cross your fingers......
Thanks Scott and Brian for answering.
Oh yes i am keeping them crossed.
How much more is Camera gonna improved. It already does beautiful imagery. I guess people is paying for Camera alone,that is what i am thinking here. Off course, than why should they include a plugin for Animator. I guess we are gonna have to wait until v8 comes out to see any development again of 3rd party plug ins .
One thing i am absolutely sure is that EI will sell more copies if they include some 3rd party plug ins. Than we will see how the market goes.I am sure people is gonna love EI again like nothing ever happened.
Hi Scott in your opinion you will not recommend a specific shader i know Afraktal and NX shading system,MrFroge awesome as Steamroller. I can see how usable will be to have them but that will never happened i will have to get a lot of money first.
Have you find in your line of work any need for a an advacend shading system, where you can just add a few shaders and focus more on the animation itself.
What about saome soft dynamics everything i see on the dynamics gallery is for hard bodies what about soft bodies?
I thought this might interested to anyone getting into MotionGraphics.
Ednumber0, interesting question. I may be a little abnormal here but here is how I “GENERALLY” work, related to shading and shaders.
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#1 There are very few shaders I have found that dont look ‘cheesy’ or like lo end 3d. The ones that have powerful
capabilities can look beautiful, but take a while to render. I would LOVE an mforge set of Pre Sets, and I know
NX ‘had or has’ a repository of settings. Nothing was real ‘easy’ to me. I generally am, or need to work
pretty fast, I only have so much time to put in a project before I ‘lose money’ on it. Simply, if someone
wants a basic 3D logo build and move from an illustrator file, and only has $500-$750 to spend, I need to get
that done in a day. I dont have time to mess around with a bunch of test renders to get it just right.
In logo and graphics work, getting a texture just so is RARELY appreciated or even noticed in this kind of
work. My next paragraph explains how I get my work looking good fast
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#2 Over my 16 years I have purchased, created and archived over 300 gigabytes of texture files, reflection files
Animated effects, and animated environments. This tedious and career long organization has been a huge
benefit for me. I rarely have seen a brick texture shader better than my hundreds of brick walls with
bump\displacement maps built in them that I own that render extremely fast. Same with metals, woods
tiles, etc etc. As a post production artist and mograph animator, I am able to quickly grab hi quality reflections
textures and environments that render beautifully and FAST. So my ‘dont tell anyone secret’ is that I rarely
use any EI or third party shaders in my work. I OWN all those tools, and on things like my NEW 3d logo, I
don’t mind trying them out, but my library, or “bag of tricks” as called by my old FOX boss is perfect for 90% of
my needs. I even have that data insured at a high value amount if ever lost. For hi resoulution still work
and even for mograph work where you have a nice amount of time to spend on the project, these shaders
can be pretty cool. I have had “SOME” render issues with these shaders with unwanted Noise that looks
horrible for broadcast. So beware, and have a broadcast monitor to view your work on, NOT your lcd.
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#3 So off of the top of my head, and from a mograph point of view, I would look to GOOD texture libraries and
hdri / environmental reflection files FIRST. Than, maybe add an NX. But for mograph work EI is great right
out of the box. Use your photoshop skills and google images to get your hands on tons of nice potential
textures. Just be aware of resolution. I always use large maps to be safe at all sizes. This is not efficient if
you are constructing a huge file with hundreds of objects, but again, we tend to not be creating files with massive polygon counts. (most the time) so I get away with it. When working with FAST turnaround times, you just have to cut certain corners at times.
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ALL THESE COMMENTS ARE FROM A FAST DEADLINE MOTION GRAPHICS POINT OF VIEW ONLY. Ei has good shaders that work for others quite well.
That is some good pointers. Yes i have a few texture libraries but not with bump and reflection map in the same texture file. I should work on that. I just want to be able to do for example a logo comes in and i get to melt or transform it into dust without going into AFTER EFFECTS and than the dust or the liqauid fallas into a shape of the one of the characters of the film or one of the initialas of a name of a character in the film..
You see where am i getting to?
Since i am not working for the spanish tv network i have more time to dedicate to my work,and i like it to be top quality. I want to avoid character animation but i cant get away form it . I want to be able to animate a flock of birds that create a custom shape. So as you can see character animation tools are needed .
The only real ‘soft body’ stuff I use are flags, banners and
cloth. Simcloth is pretty cool, but I use Zaxwerks flag plug in after effects most.
I can control it better. And you can make most any Fabric or shape with great
control and easy mapping. The most underrated skill most good mograph artist have
is their compositing abilities. Incorporating a 2d flag into a 3d scene or the other way around
requires a good eye.
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Soft bodies are just not going to be in animator from what I gather. In motion graphics you tend to see them
in projects produced by some of the hi end visual effects and mograph houses in LA and around the country
using Maya and some using C4d. Most commercial work does not require this, I find. I have used deformations
in EI to sort of ‘simluate’ a few softbody like motions in my work. But rarely.
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When companies capable of creating films like Shrek and Rattatouli? decide to dabble in commercial work as well
they can be a force to be reckoned with. You can bet you will see a whole arsenal of softbody work, massive, fluids,
fur, dynamics and anything else they want. A client will need a huge budget, but they will get some of the best effects and animation work out there. Of course they will have a TEAM of artists working on it.
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fyi textures I have tend to have bump and alpha information in them. Reflections are their own individual files.
Well, my friend, I hate to say this, but if you want THAT kind of detail ENTIRELY in 3d, your going to need maya unlimited
real flow, and a heck of a lot of time to learn it. Most people who read me know I am ‘slowly’ learning Maya to accent my EI work. (its a 3-5yr plan
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I, personally can and would do it in a combination of Apps. Some 3d, some AE, some particle illusion etc. If you can do that at a hi level all in 3d you have a nice career here in Hollywood awaiting you!
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The ae plugin ‘particular’ can do a great job of getting your flock of birds to be controlled and form a shape in AE’s
3d space. No character animation skills required.
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I would be considered a generalist animator. With hi level skills in a number of specialty apps along with the major ones
like AE, and EI/Maya - not hi end yet. You need to be able to do it all at a good to very good level to be a successful
generalist.
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a 3d generalist is just that, you will focus only on 3d, but ALL ASPECTS of it. You will need a package that is deep enough and stable enough to allow you to do this. My choice is Maya for this. Just be prepared for years of learning
the techniques of all MAYAS tools. Id even recommend going to school, (longer than I did) to learn it.
In LA here, you see ads all the time for “texturer” “fluids guy” “simulation specialists” etc. That just shows you how deep the learning curve is for maya that you can make a living specializing in just one aspect of a 3d tool.
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My only advice would be to realistically factor in your learning time, AND then, the access to these jobs. I moved to LA to be around a huge production community, and so far, I love the opportunities I have had in less than 1 year!
Im hoping the next 3 or 4 years will grow more opportunity for me.
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Good Luck
Very true i want to do it all . I am not realistically thinking here, as i get deeper into the visual effects you just want to learn everything at the same time. I love Motion Tracking. But to work as Motion Tracker that is a different story. I admire people doing Matte Paintings but to be an artist on that and paint in Glass is another story.
But my main focus is to be able to elaborate a usually a 1 to 3 minute promo with beautiful imagery . 3d is my main focus i want to be able to do it all in 3d space as 3d space interface in After Effects is not yet IMOP well implemented i will be happy if they get the MOTION interface.
But yes i could do that flock of bird in Particular i just have to animate one bird, you right . But i still need to animate one of the bird and do the texturing.Not for a close up level but it can come out pretty good , you right.
In the states is more specific but i remember when i was collaborating with some companies there, they will required you to be a generalist animator.A lot of After Effects, some 3d application and off course creative.
I downloaded the Demo for ProAniamtor and i have to say is a beautiful tool to have for any mographer.
PS: Checking for example if i had purchased C4D v9 and i wanted to upgrade i will be buying a new version of the same application. I wonder if people that get these product think about upgrading and how much will it cost.
Thanks Scott i dont want to be in a computer all my life i like to do some editing and shooting as well. Gee you see i want to do everything. I got some knowledge of maya but it was 350 hrs and i just wanted more and more good experience tho, i feel stronger and able to understand almost every piece of software.Syntheyes is my next goal , being able to have an object in 3d space compose with a real enviroment is something very unusual to have in any production.
By the way i know Scott might know of mograph.net fantastic works and jobs wait for you there. and all kind of resources for 3d in general.I might think it os a good bookmark.
your kind of all over the place here. 3d space in after effects is just fine for COMPOSITING things into 3d rendered scenes. Thats all I am saying. Not a good 3d environment as a whole however.
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Particular can be as detailed as you need it to be if you have the Ram. Also, flying birds have massive motion blur on them so detail is blurred out a lot.
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Pro animator is Great For modeling 3d imagery from illustrator files. But, it is horrible as far as animation tools, rendering, speed etc etc. It is why I choose to use it for modeling alone.
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I joined the web site, thanks. Its really Pink if you like that color......
that spot is just weird to me. Very few effects at all, which is fine, but a bunch of people shot in tights
for the whole time, until the very end when they have a rather un original forming of the Audi Logo.
Just personal taste. Nicely shot footage though. I just dont know that it makes me want an Audi.
Common Scott is just different from any other car spot. I think so. A lot of people in tights,you killing me, i am laughing so hard now. Yeah it gets in the way of the concept , why will i buy this car?. As always you right on the money but it is a nice idea therefore that is why i like the spot. Well glad you joined, hey about the color i am not the designer dont blame it on me.
And i was just saying that i wish After Effects had that same MOTION 3d space UI, that is all i love After Effects i cant live without it. Is one of these tools you just need them.
Glad to hear from you Scott and thanks for the multiple advices,is always appreciated.
eventually. EIAS should sell a few more seats
Yeah it gets in the way of the concept , why will i buy this car?. As always you right on the money but it is a nice idea therefore that is why i like the spot. Well glad you joined, hey about the color i am not the designer dont blame it on me.
